Will Landlords be able to apply for heat pump grants in April 2022?

Reply to the comment left by DSR at 25/10/2021 - 17:53
I'm not sure it's pointless. If you have a property that *has* to be heated but cannot be insulated to modern standards then it seems to me that you should put in whatever insulation can be put in without doing too much damage and put in whatever form of renewable energy can be put in. Otherwise your only options are (1) Do nothing (2) demolish.

See useful info on:-
https://www.which.co.uk/reviews/home-grants/article/home-grants/energy-company-obligation-eco-arbLy8A2GejX
and for local grants/advice https://www.simpleenergyadvice.org.uk/grants

Internal wall insulation costs typically £50 per sq metre. External wall insulation costs about £100 p sq m. Perhaps £7,000 to £17,000 (+ possible scaffolding and even traffic lights and council licences to use them.....)
Cavity WI is about £500.
Most houses built pre 1920 have solid walls. Many rented houses are pre 1920.

Wall Insulation would be needed to be able to use a heat pump. Then another £6,000 to £15,000 for the heat pump.

Rough calculations suggest a rather long payback - if I have this correct?
Cheapest for solid wall is IWI @ £50 sq/m (4”, so internal floor area reduced by 8” both directions and considerable disruption).

That reduces losses through external walls by about 1.5w per sq/m. *
With 3.8p per kWh (typical current gas price)
So in 1,000 hours saves about 5.7 pence p sq/m
In 1,000,000 hours of heating use, saves £57 p sq/m
Therefore even if heating used 24hrs/day for 1/2 the year would take 200 years to Break even (at today’s gas costs)

Which is just what the recommendations in my EPC suggested to improve the current C and D ratings!

* https://www.homebuilding.co.uk/advice/internal-wall-insulation-guide
“The U value of a material is the rate at which heat (in watts) is lost through each square meter of the surface. A lower figure means better thermal performance.

An uninsulated cavity wall will have a U value of around 1.5W/m2 and there will also be a relatively high level of cold bridging due to the cavity ties
A solid 225mm brick wall will be around 1.9W/m2
A solid stone wall will be around 1.7W/m2 to 1.4W/m2 (depending on the thickness)
Current Building Regulations require a maximum U value of 0.3W/m2 and realistically 0.2W/m2. Achieving that U value for solid walls will mean installing at least 100mm of rigid insulation (Celotex, Kingspan or similar)”

Reply to the comment left by Chris Byways at 25/10/2021 - 23:28
That's interesting Chris, thanks for sharing.

One of my properties has cavity walls but no insulation. I've had somebody point a thermal imaging camera at it in winter in the evening with the heating on. The cavity walls are not where the heat is being lost. The heat is being lost around the windows. So I would consider forms of external render (as opposed to cladding); some forms of external render would improve insulation. I would consider upgrading the windows. Putting in internal insulation would result in me having to rip up all the parquet floors and replace them which would probably cost me thousands. And I would consider biomass boilers, photovoltaic tiles, photovoltaic panels and ground source heat pumps for the part of the property that will have modern insulation once extended (effectively meaning that I have zoned heating areas); but I would not consider cavity wall insulation.

Reply to the comment left by Beaver at 25/10/2021 - 18:34
in Grade 2 listed buildings with solid walls and no gas supply this is where its going to be tricky! They are small flats to boot and not south facing. Once for example has the most efficient electric heaters possible. Internal and external is not viable and there is a flat staggered above so there is only half a loft space. This is so limited in headroom you can't get a man up there. I can't put in DG windows either. The old guy is happy as he is. I tried to find out what if any ECO grants are viable (non without any insulation measures first) but he doesn't want to be bothered. Done all I can. What else can I do??

Reply to the comment left by Beaver at 26/10/2021 - 08:53
but the way I understand it is you could have cavity wall insulation to tick the EPC box. While you know that isn't the source of the heat loss, you are doing what the government in their ultimate wisdom have said you need to do to comply. That will score more points and assist to the C level required.

Reply to the comment left by Beaver at 26/10/2021 - 08:53
There’s a scarcity of information on IWI in my view. Taking 4” off internal walls is challenging, though easy if a new build. Surely space age materials could be MUCH thinner, easier to apply, a range of adapters for radiator brackets light switches and sockets, and verification products are approved etc.

Surely a range of verified heat loss reduction carpet underpays for when carpets are being renewed on concrete floors? I asked last year and was advised ‘it’s not worth it’ but I can’t believe it couldn’t be quickly developed effectively.

Why not MHRV with compressors to COP of 3+ on incoming air? Or at least Heat Recovery Ventilation without VAT if our politicians were serious about engaging property owners in reducing energy?

Reply to the comment left by DSR at 26/10/2021 - 09:49
The problem is that putting in cavity wall insulation would do damage in the properties I would be looking at and would be expensive to rectify. That's why I wouldn't consider it.

Cavity walls have a function - they stop water getting in, they let water out, and they also provide some insulation. The ties between the walls make little or no difference in terms of thermal bridging, or at least, not in the walls in my properties. And that would be fixed by rendering.

Reply to the comment left by Chris Byways at 26/10/2021 - 09:51
Taking 4 inches off internal walls isn't just challenging; it's very challenging and very expensive.

Reply to the comment left by Beaver at 26/10/2021 - 09:56Yes £6,000 upwards, but if higher EPC grades are demanded something has to be done!
EWI isn’t practical on timber framed buildings (and listed) - as in my avatar.
I will seek permission to install double glazing-in the past the answer was no.
The earlier comment on ‘efficient’ electric heating puzzles me. ALL electric heating is 100% efficient. You can have time & thermostatic controls (or even ‘oil filled’!) or use it in a heat pump to harness external heat. But all the hype by some manufacturers they are highly efficient is rubbish. 1kWh of heat is 1kWh of energy. But electric heating is very expensive - about 4.5 times the cost of natural gas per kWh.

Reply to the comment left by Chris Byways at 26/10/2021 - 10:08
In terms of the efficiency of electric part of the efficiency debate is how you get it to the property. That's why we transfer electricity at high EMF (volts if you like) but drop down at a sub-station.

The thing to remember is that every house has the potential to lose energy. But every house that has the potential to lose a lot of energy also has the potential to generate power. Whatever that house generates from renewable sources, be that PV tiles or panels, sun powered direct heating of water or anything else is reducing the carbon footprint.

Those houses are not all going to be bulldozed so for any policy to make sense every dwelling should have a way forward.