West Bromwich Building Society Tracker Margins Legal Action

This is my 1st post on this site.
I have read every posts to-date regarding WBBS.
What do we know!

WBBS will have been advised that by taken this action it will put them in a win win situation.
Win one for WBBS, those landlords, big or small, who sit on the fence and let others fight their battle, are part of WBBS plan.
Win two for WBBS, those landlords, big or small, who hold back monies there by giving them the upper hand within the legal system.
Don’t be part of their plan, join the action group, put your money up and don’t default on your payments.
We all know, those of us who have sent our cheques to The Law Department, we are up for this fight. The facts are there, we all know WBBS cannot win this legal battle even they will know it.
I believe those who are named, in the legal action will end up paying the same, no increase.
Those sitting on the fence and those withholding mortgage payments, their target groups, will give WBBS the extra income they feel needed to run their business.

To Mark Alexander
I would like to say a big thank you for your efforts to date.
I would like to add there is not one of us in the action group going to back down and if the 100 or so is required to fund this action, we will I have no doubt. Our commitment is total be assured.

To all interested parties.
Please be positive in your comments posted, this site will be monitored. Please also consider your actions regarding WBBS, try not to be part of their hidden agenda.

To Richard Adams.
Hang on in there; stay positive we are in this together.

Reply to the comment left by "Mark Alexander" at "29/10/2013 - 22:23":

Hi Mark

I presume that if the WBBS did do all of the above and the class action goes our way then if they had sold my property I could be able to claim consequencial loss. i.e. the rental income I would have lost in perpetuity, as I would want to leave them to my children. Not an inconsiderable sum so I suggest they may think twice about this action. You do touch on this later in the forum. This does not change my mind let them sue me I will pay what is agreed until proven in law that I have to pay more. So chin up everyone lets fight them to the end.

I think we are all getting off the point again. Mark's statement earlier this year made it clear to all of us that this has to be a very focused "one issue" campaign if it is to succeed. Any talk of "non disclosure" settements is not helpful as I think there is no possibility that wbbs will offer this. If the reasons for this are not clear then I have repeated them below - as I see them. Similarly, any talk of lessees not fulfilling their side of their mortgage terms which is to pay the amount due (at least due until the Court states otherwise) weakens the case for the fight as part of the argument must be why should only one side have to abide by the clear agreement. I really do think that the way forward is very clear as explained by Mark and everyone needs to accept that things have changed slightly and there is now only one course of action..

There is a very big difference between BOI and WBBS. BOI is a Bank, a Bank can operate in ways a building society which is a mutual cannot do. They make profits from all sorts of things and can, as has been proven, hide gains and losses for ages - hence the Banking crisis. If WBBS try and do a "non disclosure" deal the only places I think they can take the money from is their reserves which is either savers' funds or money they raise on the open market and have to pay back. Their financial statements are much easier to understand than a Banks and if they tried to lose funds in this way I think there would be a huge backlash and I think it would take only one or two determined people to force an EGM to debate such a decision.

I think that after Mark's statement this site was in a really good, focused, place on a campaign with a very strong chance of success. Please let everyone stay on the course he has chartered for us.

Reply to the comment left by "Richard Adams" at "30/10/2013 - 11:17":

Richard, I would encourage you to think long and hard before selling up or doing anything that would give the lender an excuse to appoint a receiver or exercise any other of their powers. There are legal hurdles that you would need to overcome if you sold up and tried afterwards to claim consequential losses. It is by no means certain what, if anything, you would be able to claim so my view is that if at all possible it would be best to sit tight and pay the increase in the hope that you will eventually get the money back.

Reply to the comment left by "Seething Landlord" at "30/10/2013 - 13:56":

I appreciate your advice Seething Landlord. I have seldom thought longer and harder about anything! At least there is 5 weeks odd to ponder.
Were I to sell the property from financial necessity now I accept that gaining from the class action win would be virtually lost to me. Tough but that's life. Of more concern is the kissing goodbye to the increase in capital value that might accrue in coming years. I'm in a hole and that's the end of it, period. To pay the increased rate demanded by WBBS has to be funded which in short term is a big struggle.
But PLEASE folks ignore my predicament and press on with the fight. Whatever I end up doing I'm with you all the way - and have lobbed in my contribution. My dilemna is just a sideshow for me to resolve.

Couldn't agree more: focus, focus and focus...

Mark and Justin are doing a fantastic job here and they have my total support, only hope that more and more borrowers join the group to take this all the way to its conclusion...

Well done to all contributing - I for one at least feel that I am not sitting on the side line and doing something about WB's greedy and unethical ways...

Reply to the comment left by "Ian Burton" at "30/10/2013 - 12:50":

Hi Ian

If you or anybody else does continue to pay only what you and believe is due and WBBS take aggressive action against you then in the event that we win a case against them you would certainly be in a position to claim for consequential losses based on their aggressive action, e.g. appointing LPA receivers, forced sale etc..

The problems would really occur if we were to lose a Court case against West Brom.

If WBBS were to back track then you would still have a claim based on any losses occurring from their aggressive action.

However, win or lose, if you were to sell one of the properties yourself it might be very difficult to prove that you were not planning to sell the property anyway so this would make a claim much more difficult.

That's just the way I see it anyway, by no means does the above constitute professional advice.
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Reply to the comment left by "Mark Alexander" at "30/10/2013 - 16:48":

I massively admire Ian for his stance on grounds of sod WBBS, My reasons are because I may have no option,
If I sell my property within 4-6 months then all I could claim when the action is won would be the extra mortgage repayments I had to make in interim. Peanuts.
Might though consequential loss include "I had to sell now because of WBBS action for £200,000 but a year later value of property is £205,000 say. Please hand over the difference!" I doubt it somehow. Pity.
Still like I say PLEASE don't let this issue sidetrack the rest of you. Up to individuals to decide. Press on with publicity and the action. .

Hi Mark Richard

Thanks for the comments. I understand Mark that all your comments are personal comments with no expert advice. In this case as I feel (and I hope so does everyone else) that we have a very winnable case and so I do not think its such a big gamble. I reckon the gamble is for the WBBS because if they do gamble, send in the heavy mob and lose then they may be liable for consequential loss. Also another thought I have had on this same front is whether we (i) could sue for deformation of character. The thinking being if they trash my credit rating (not that I am really bothered but I may be in the future {especially if the WBBS have caused it}) I could sue them as I would be vindicated and they would have smeared my good name without just cause. I am not a lawyer but surely one cannot defame someone else without having a good cause not just a suspicion? i.e. I defaulted on a legal agreement. At the moment its only their opinion of the legal agreement and as I am disputing it, there surely needs to be a confirmation of the legality as I would be arguing that they new in advance and so deliberately smeared my name before they new the legality of the action. (convoluted or what) An interesting thought perhaps or at least perhaps something for the WBBS readers to go away report and ponder.
The only other comment is whilst I have the money THEY have to get it off me BUT whilst THEY have the money and go bust or simply refuse (and so I have to go to court yet again at my expense utill I am vindicated )what chance do I have?

UPDATE

1001 people have now completed the Class Action Expression Of Interest Form

Justin has reported that funds received to date now stand at £42,480

Justin has also received a response from West Brom's solicitors. They have not answered any of his questions and said

"Our client has made its position with regard to its right to increase the interest rate margin in respect of these mortgages very clear. You have stated that you intend to instruct counsel to seek an opinion on the legality of the the margin increase and that, depending on that advice, legal action may follow. Given your intentions it would be entirely inappropriate for our client to respond to the questions you have posed. It is for you to seek Counsels advice and if you then challenge our clients position we will respond accordingly".
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