UC47 rejected but tenant consistently in arrears?

Ooh 6 figures. Ouch, that's most Landlords scared then.

Only fair to share if this is the same situation you find yourself in. As per Bill's advice I sent this email to the DWP District Manager when my UC47 was rejected...I have also attached DWP response after.. I hope it helps others 🙂

Ms X,

I have just received a letter of notification that states you are unable to make any MPTL payments to me in regard to tenant arrears.

I feel this decision must be challenged - and I would like to make reference to the APA Guidelines, Section 5 Annexe A which specifically highlights Tier 1 factors that point to the highly likely/probably need for such payments to be made directly to the Landlord.

As laid out in the UC47 (copy attached) you can see that the tenant's arrears have been mounting up over a considerable amount of time. This clearly reflects that the tenant is very disorganised and a manages money chaotically. (1.3 of the guidelines).

Indeed on 14 April 2019 the DWP stepped in and paid her accumulated arrears at that time as she was again subject to eviction due to rent arrears. The situation has simply continued.

The guidelines further suggest that a payment may be redirected to the Landlord where the sum involved is more than 1 months of arrears and where there is proof if the tenants persistent failure to pay/late payments causing a threat to their tenancy.

Guideline 1.8 is perhaps even more applicable in this instance as the tenant is now subject to eviction. Court proceedings are already in hand. The tenant was issued with both a Section 21 and Section 8 in late 2019 citing arrears (well before the coronavirus lockdown). My solicitor is currently awaiting an imminent date from the Court for a planned telephone hearing in this regard.

I await a review of this request in light of the details above.

Regards
RL

REPLY>>>

Good afternoon RL
As per phone call earlier here is the explanation that I gave you over the phone.
In summary, having reviewed the concerns raised by the landlord along with our Managed Payment Guidance, we have overturned the decision to refuse a managed payment directly to the landlord.
A managed payment has now been put in place for the rent arrears requested. There is already a managed payment in place for future rent contributions.
I have since asked regarding financial terms and the response was –
The payment should be sent to the landlord on the customers next pay date which is 18th May. I wont be able to see the actual full amount until 11th May when the customers statement is generated.
If you want me to get them to contact you on 11 May to advise you with the amount I can do, just let me know.
Thank you
Ms X

Reply to the comment left by WP at 06/05/2020 - 19:59
WP

A well crafted note, like yours, directed to the right person in DWP, reminding them of their own published processes, invariably works.

I’m told, DWP is about to rollout the online APA system, in the next few months. Several of my clients, including Caridon Property Services, have been utilising this for past 12-18 months, substantially reducing previous rental losses. So, hopefully, the not-fit-for-purpose UC 47 will soon be defunct.

Bill

Well done WP, brilliant.

Yes Bill I still get now Tier 1 complaints people tell me Mick, u must fill in the UC47 form, it does work.
I say Oh is that so, why have we got an online trial then? Even them in the online trial acknowledge the UC47 form has problems & doesn't always get done.

This is one big problem with DWP UC, no two way communication.

I sent UC director Neil Couling a tenants Section 21 notice saying Cheers Neil, you've just made this tenant of 23 years of mine now homeless, we could have solved this so easy.

He replied back not saying Oh dear Mick, what can we do to solve it, but a load of Govt rammel tosh about the new 3 months notice (which I'd done) on Section 21 during Coronavirus times.

U couldn't make it up, he was not interested at all what UC had done wrong.

Ongoing Problem with UC all within this thread

I am having all types of problems with UC at the moment. I normally send my UC47 form to ucfull.service@dwp.gov.uk and they make a decision. They don’t appear to read anything within the email but only look at the attached UC47, Rent Schedule & Tenancy Agreement.

I have just received the following email for the tenant that I was getting “Managed Payments” & APA from January 2019 to January 2020 (after having filled in 2 UC47 forms towards the end of 2018) & then it stopped. I sent a new UC47 on 19 April 2020 having not been paid for Feb, March & April 2020 and got the following reply:

Reference: Direct rent payments

Dear Clint
We received your request for direct rent payments for xxxxxxxx.
We are unable to set up direct rent payments to you.
Direct rent payments could not be set up for one or more of the following reasons:
• your tenant does not get Universal Credit
• your tenant does not claim housing support for the address you supplied
• your tenant must be in at least one month's worth of arrears, accrued over two or more months
• One of the tier 1 or 2 conditions haven't been met
We cannot give you specific details because of data sharing regulations.
You should speak to your tenant to make sure the correct information has been supplied to Universal Credit.
If you think you gave us the wrong information, such as the wrong house number you can request direct rent payments again with the correct information.
Your tenant needs to pay their rent, and any rent they owe, directly to you.
You can make another request for direct rent payments if your tenant's circumstances change.
For more information, search for "universal credit and landlords" on GOV.UK
This email address cannot accept replies.

From
Universal Credit

For security, Universal Credit doesn't include phone numbers or links in emails. You can find the phone number on the GOV.UK website.

I know that the tenant has been paid the rent for February, March & April as a UC officer had told me this when I had phoned UC as they said that the tenant had requested that the payment be made to themselves. The tenant is keeping the money and is not responding to any communication with me although, at one point I phoned up where she answered (as she did not realise that it was me) and said she was still on benefits, and would send me a copy of her journal from January 2020 to the present within the hour. I did not receive anything from her since and she is avoiding any further correspondence.

I am now concerned that the tenant will be paid the rent which will not be passed to me until she is evicted. I have already written to my MP. I am not sure who else to write to. Could someone provide me with the email or emails that I should write to and I will send copies to all or, at least let me know any other way forward. Sherrelle from Caridon is already dealing with complaints in respect of the three months that I have lost for this tenant.

The emails I will be sending to so far will be: ucfull.service@dwp.gov.uk, UC.SERVICECENTREHOUSING@DWP.GSI.GOV.UK & to the email of the Jobcentre plus service leader

Hi Clint

One of the reasons you may encountering difficulties is, you're attaching more than the UC 47. DWP views your email as non-secure and so asks you to simply forward the Non-secure form. If you attach any additional docs, like a rent statement, tenancy agreement, there's a possibility your application was deleted. Hard to believe, I know, but we discovered this malpractice a few years ago.

Another NO, NO is, don't put any personal details in the email subject matter. Again, if you do, DWP will often delete without even looking at the detail.

In terms of follow-up, I would recommend you sending a "Stage 1 Complaint" to the Service Manager you first emailed.

My latest members' bulletin which I produced in response to some of the earlier Q & A on this thread. https://universalcreditadvice.com/articles/how-can-prs-landlords-letting-agents-secure-direct-payments-of-universal-credit/

Bill

Reply to the comment left by Bill irvine at 11/05/2020 - 14:32
Thanks once again for your advice Bill.

I had already written to my MP, with all references to criteria which supports my case from the “DWP’s Alternative Payment Arrangement (APA) scheme”, which I have read from start to finish. I have also listed the related Tier 1 facts which were stated on your website in particular to Tier 1.8.

I normally send a rent statement as, the UC47 form does not allow for many rent entries, and consequently, it would not be possible to show entries for more than that, that is allowed for. I have not had problems with attaching rent statements in the past and they seem to have been accepted.

I have always also in the body of the email requested that the payments are frozen, until an investigation has been carried out, and I have also included my bank details. I now understand why, my emails are sometimes delayed or ignored. I have never had the payments frozen and in this respect, I must get something done in respect of the next payment for this tenant which will be on 27th May 2020.

I will now send a Stage 1 Complaint as you have suggested. Could you let me know if I should still send amended UC47 email application to ucfull.service@dwp.gov.uk, and to the Jobcentre plus service leader?

Further to the above, I would appreciate it if you could send me the stage 1 & Stage 2 email addresses, or a link to them as although, I have used them before, I am currently unable to find them.

Is there anyway of getting onto the new PRS application process as, if this is the case, I may reconsider taking on benefit tenants.

BTW, I have made an application to become a member of your website where I am sure there is very useful information.

Reply to the comment left by Clint at 11/05/2020 - 13:56
Clint,

I'm not sure if I've put this in this thread, but I send the below to my tenants by whatsapp when we do a joint complaint together.

Bill gave me all this info few years ago.
It's a long process but sometimes in 2 weeks or so, someone in Tier 1 'may' read it & ring u or look & say this is silly, we can solve this now. Not guaranteed, but small chance they may read it.
I know it's not an answer now, but it's still the clock ticking down if u don't do anything.

Some humans in the Job Centre are very good, I have 2 local managers & someone in the local service centre. I've had 2 solved today.
Actually had a DWP Fraud man ring me today (after emailing service centre which got a response) accusing me of Fraud for joint tenancy until he/we sussed out the Case manager got all the rent wrong & was about to pay me the whole joint rent £1100pm for single man when me & the Fraud man know he's only allowed the UC LHA HE 1 bed rate £469pm. And how can that be my fault when I'm not the man hitting the button paying myself? Shocking how little DWP know about rents & rent increases & joint tenancies & LHA rates.

Bill can correct me if any of the info is wrong below:

If UC have messed up, u MUST complain. Otherwise it could be over a year before u get solved. Get the clock ticking down now.

Email N-EMIDLANDS.CRT@DWP.GSI.GOV.UK (this address for Nottinghamshire)
& put Stage 1 complaint in subject.
In the body of the e-mail you should provide all the details of the tenant, address, NINO, DOB etc. or your landlord reference number, a summary of your concerns (what has happened) and the issues still to be addressed.

If they don’t reply in 15 days, write to: Correspondence@dwp.gsi.gov.uk & put Stage 2 Complaint in subject
And u could just forward your previous email. Saying you have waited 15 working days.

If they don’t reply in 15 working days, you then write to ice@dwp.gov.uk & tell them you haven’t had a reply.
ICE normally say You have to have a referral from DWP. You then tell ICE Mick Roberts said YOU HAVE TO take my complaint on, otherwise DWP may as well never reply if you aren’t going to look at complaint.

You need to start complaining to get the system changed or u could be in same boat next year.

Thanks for the info Mick. I have been exploring what to do if all fails but could not find anywhere further to send rather than ice. Have just sent my emails to Stage 1 which has a different email address for my area.
It appears that you are well known at ice so I will take your advice and state what you have said if need be.
The struggle is making progress

I tried using lhc.crtteam1@dwp.gov.uk & lhc.crtteam1@dwp.gsigov.uk for stage 1 complaints and they both came back as being unrecognised. I did not use the one that Mick has used as it is for Nottinghamshire.
Does anyone know what the email address for the Croydon/Surrey area is, or where the stage 1 complaints email addresses may be found for different areas? I personally could not find it on the web although, I found the lhc.crtteam1@dwp.gsigov.uk email on an article of Bill Irvine which was published in 2016 which appears to now be obsolete.