Test case for landlords under EU Human rights act possible?

Reply to the comment left by "Peter Fisher - Boddington Law - (Fixed Fee Law)" at "06/07/2015 - 13:28":

Hi Peter, interesting about the stat demand tactic. Do they tend to vacate the premises upon receipt? If not, you would still need to go down the usual route to obtain a possession order though?

Roughly about three months ago I rang my local council, explained who I was and asked if this person (my tenant) has been claiming housing benefits, and if so the tenant has not paid any rent since November 2014 and rumours from the area is that tenant is subletting?

She says she's claiming housing benefits of £600 per month and what the tenant is doing is fraud. Do you want me to put you through to the fraud team she asked? I said yes. Then she says I will send you some information to pay housing benefits directly to you! This form I received July 2nd 2014, was the council aware of the eviction date of July 9th 2015 at 13:00 hours?

The lady at the council put me through to the fraud team who told me they would investigate the matter rigorously! We exchanged emails with more factual details, but the fraud team did nothing and the council continued to pay housing benefits to the tenant! After complaint, places I visited small council vans has been in my sight regular!

Repossession order was granted April 23rd 2015 for May 7th 2015 by the county court, tenant stayed in the property and appealed the eviction. Case dismissed in court . Bailiffs eviction agreed for July 9th 2015. She again on July 8th 2015 appealed the eviction claiming she has £6,000 water bill without evidence again case dismissed.

July 9th she again appealed the eviction and a circuit Judge heard the appealed and given the tenant until July 16th 2015 I think, no paperwork as yet! I was given half hour by the CC to get to the hearing 25 miles away still in my jam jams. No time even to get my war paint on! Heavy traffic reached approx 2pm. Case heard! What the .... sakes that's all about then! Are council is meddling?

Rudolph.

Hi All

One thing I really like about this forum is we all share advice and our different views. It is a fantastic learning tool for all.

Of course we may have different views and we should respect that. I fully support Marks Alexander's point.

If you don't like what you read then there must be a polite way and non offensive way to respond. I hope you all respect my view on this.

I have lost money to bad tenants and as yet not had to go to court to evict. I have many times stated those from Councils.CAB and Shelter etc giving this advice should be held accountable for the costs to the landlords.

If a tenant claims any benefit and gives wrong information to obtain it. They can be prosecuted for fraud why should it be different for housing benefit. The most ridiculous part is they expect the landlord to pay back any over payment they call it. (when it is fraud).

Why cant the NLA push for all Councils CAB Shelter to record any advice given. I bet it would be different from what they say now. It would be in there interest and would not cost much in this day and age.

As pointed out earlier all the programmes on TV the tenants are all saying the same they where advised by the council. So surely that should be evidence in it self. After all if you can use CCTV to prosecute what is the difference in what they have said in the programme.

As for money the reason the landlords are like this is they risk losing there own home to settle debts with the bank. Are some are so stressed out at the way the tenants, organisations and council act.

I recently had a case where I had been helping my tenant for five months to sort his benefit. I was about to call it a day as I could no longer go on with out payment.

He suddenly started to claim I was harassing him as I phoned him twice in seven days and visited his house once in that time.

I asked where this came from and he said he was advised by the housing that I could not contact him like this.

you went into any supermarket and took a bottle wine you would be arrested and up with a criminal record but these benefit cheats alter there papers which is fraud break the law nothing crazy

Here's is my analogy ....

Greece is a tenant dependant on welfare
EU is the Landlord
ECB is Wonga
Syriza is the Council’s Homelessness advisor / CAB
Merkel is the High Court Enforcement Officer

Greece has received their Housing Benefit but after buying the latest iphone, designer trainers and paying the Sky subscription there wasn’t much left over. They can’t pay the rent so they ask EU for another month to get a loan of Wonga and then they’ll definitely pay two months rent in full. It’s bloody hard to get by on what the benefit people give you these days. But unfortunately the next HB payment gets swallowed up by overdraft fees, Wonga repayments (didn’t budget for those oops), and their holiday which they now need because of all the stress. It’s all ok because Syriza has given Greece lots of help and advice and told them how unreasonable and nasty EU are being. Greece now has a better iphone and a bigger tv than EU which is starting to rile the EU. And EU hasn’t even had a holiday themselves this year. Syriza sympathises with Greece and how unfair this whole situation is, after all everyone is entitled to a little holiday and other little luxuries even if they’re not working. Syriza will see if they can arrange some emergency funding from somewhere to help Greece out in the short term. Greece is really happy now because they know if they can’t afford these repayments then they can just borrow more money to pay them. Syriza says it’s all going to be ok though because the EU will have to wait months before they can chuck Greece out on the streets, and when the time comes they’ll be given two months notice before the bailiffs actually arrive. The longer Greece hold out the better for them as this means they will get a better deal. In the meantime Greece go to Wonga to ask for some more money but those nasty bankers want to charge Greece even more interest than last time. Apparently this increase is just because Greece didn’t manage to make their payment last month. Greece wanted to make the payment but some sort of vague disaster struck and they couldn’t pay but it wasn’t their fault so how can they charge them even more now? This is so unfair because whenever people like EU want to borrow money it is easy and they don’t have to pay the massive interest rates that Greece does. And now Merkel has turned up at the door and told them that they have to leave within an hour! Surely this can’t be right because Syriza said that we would be given two months notice. Where is Greece going to go? Merkel can’t just chuck Greece out on the streets can she?

I am just about to go through my first possession. My huge wedge of paperwork hits the first post tomorrow.
The tenant has been told to stay until the bailiff arrives by CAB and council, probably going to be quite a surprise when a high court enforcement officer turns up!
Why am I seeking possession?
This tenant moved into a completely renovated house, new carpets even lovely blinds and made it uninhabitable in 3 months. Shelter has been in and agreed...bad landlord!!! Then they stopped paying the rent I, of course gave them notice to leave that expired on 4th July. They have told the council the house is uninhabitable, why would they stay...oh..I know....because it's rent free and the housing association they have applied to have a shiny new house waiting but won't give it to them until they are made homeless.
I now understand I have been a pawn a game of 'how to get a council house'
To add insult to injury...the court wants to be paid by check (who has a check book these days!) or postal order!! Did you know that postal orders have fees added, I will add this to the thousands of pounds to put the houses back together.
Anyway....
It's all a learning curve which I won't let spoil me...I have just reduced my favourite tenants rent this month by £300 so she can take her children on holiday.
Onward and upward..

Reply to the comment left by "Caroline Read" at "12/07/2015 - 20:08":

Sometimes (on the odd occasion), if you get the tenant to -or just tell the Council directly yourself- that you intend to use HCEO, pointing out they will act within 5-7 days, they will give in now and offer them the council house.

Maybe worth a shot, you have nothing to lose...

I must just comment as a former Housing Adviser with a local authority. I used the same stance as Julie, in that I was always honest with tenants and whilst empathising with their problems, being very clear that the rent is a primary responsibility. The result? Landlords would ring and ask for me, because they believed I was fair and balanced. Other advisers preferred to believe everything they were told by the "victims" who came to us.I then worked for a charity who helped the homeless into private sector accommodation and built very warm relationships, based on honesty, with many private sector landlords. Now here I am, in a pre=retirement job, working for a Landlords Association. I know that the advice has been for some years that tenants should wait until the Court orders possession before approaching the council. The CAB in our area have refused to work with landlords, though common sense is now coming in and they are offering minimal assistance.

Landlords, be aware of when rent arrears start. As soon as the tenant has failed to pay 8 weeks/2 months arrears, issue a section 8; contact the benefit section or, for Universal Credit, the DWP and get direct payment. Under UC, the arrears will be repaid, albeit slowly. Once the section 8 is issued, if not payments are made to clear arrears, go through the procedure and evict. Don't be persuaded by local authorities to let them stay. Actions always speak louder than words and the actions required where there are rent arrears are those that pay money and reduce arrears.

Reply to the comment left by "Sharon Betton" at "15/07/2015 - 12:40":

Hi Sharon

Thank you for posting.

My understanding is that, given that most landlords charge rent monthly in advance, in most cases it is possible to serve section 8 after one month and one day as opposed to waiting for two whole months.

This is because the tenant has technically missed two monthly payments after one month and one day, i.e. two months rent payments due.
.

Reply to the comment left by "Sharon Betton" at "15/07/2015 - 12:40":

Hi Sharon – As a lawyer and a landlord I have been the subject to these ‘words’ of advice by local councils. It needs a case for a tenant to be taken to court for fraud as Housing Benefit is for housing and not for the tenants to spend on whatever and I’ve seen ‘whatever’!!!!

I don’t wait till it gets to 2 months arrears – as soon as it gets to over 750.00 I hit the tenant with a Stat Demand. There is no defence, the tenant either owes the rent or not. If the tenant hasn’t paid the rent then there is NO DEFENCE and bankruptcy proceedings can follow. It tends to work.

It is about time Councils realised that by ‘annoying landlord's in the way they do they will get less and less help from us when they need our help.