15:55 PM, 12th August 2013, About 11 years ago 74
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We’re a professional couple with a limited company which provides a technology solution to the NHS. It suits our circumstances to rent at this moment in time.
We had a 4-year rental of a lovely apartment until last Summer, when the owner decided to downsize and move back into the property. It was a good relationship, we had treated the property as if it had been our own investment and we parted as friends – with our deposit paid back in full.
After much searching we found a 3-bed town house which appeared to offer us everything we needed. The letting agent was a member of NAEA/ARLA and appeared to be respectable. There were some agreed remedial works to be dealt with and we were given assurances that these would be attended to in due course. We moved into the property in late August 2012.
Sadly, by the beginning of November, it was apparent that the property had some significant problems. There was extensive water penetration upstairs and a rising damp problem to the ground floor. The letting agent was informed immediately, with photographic evidence and a request for urgent assistance. We moved our furniture from the 3rd bedroom.
A ‘trades-person’ appeared in due course, with a notepad and pencil but with no damp meter. A report was promised, but was not forthcoming. The letting agent promised to send another contractor. This one only worked weekends and couldn’t agree a time to call; that visit never took place.
I called the landlords contractor to arrange the remedial work to be completed – missing doors, exposed wires, etc. He visited early November, measured up, made notes, promised to return – but failed.
We spent the most horrendous Christmas and New Year in the house. There was serious damp penetration, black mould which was constantly being removed. Slugs were climbing the walls. The house was very cold and the more that we heated it – the worse the damp became. We telephoned, wrote, sent photographs, yet the letting agent did nothing; there were plenty of replies – unbelievably stating that they were attempting to do everything as quickly as possible. We initially resigned ourselves to getting out of the house at the end of our AST.
In early-February, I wrote the strongest letter to letting agent with photos. A survey was made by Peter Cox, a pretty damning report which agreed with our complaint – serious damp and rain penetration. I wrote again, asking for compensation and a reduction in rent. This was refused. The letting agent had said that the landlord was absent; it transpired this wasn’t the case.
We tracked the landlord down and demanded a meeting. The landlord appeared, agreed with us in full and said that it was the first he knew of the problem. He agreed that we should be compensated and that this was the letting agents responsibility. Our landlord sat in our home, apologising and promised us both that this would be resolved. He remarked how clean we kept the property. The next day he had changed his mind and said that our grievance was with the letting agent. The following day – the EHO (Environmental Health Officer) inspected. That week, the missing doors and exposed electrics were attended to. We sent 2 requests to the letting agent, for the landlords address – these were refused.
A week later we received a section 21 notice to quit. The landlords address was given as c/o a family member in the South – presumably to thwart a legal action by us.
It turned out that the landlord had known of the problems. He’d applied for a grant for roof insulation, in my name – without my knowledge – and prior to our first meeting. It transpired that the letting agents were not members of ARLA or NAEA and we contacted both organisations and Rightmove to get these false affiliations removed. The letting agent claimed an oversight.
We spoke with our MP who has written to the CEO of the local authority, in order to push the EHO. The EHO wrote to the letting agent and the landlord but there was no response. We then began to receive threats from the letting agent to enter the property to inspect and allow viewings; we made a formal complaint to the Police and this is logged with a fast-track number in the event that they continue. We threatened to change the locks and the letting agent replied that this was not necessary.
We defended the section 21 notice on the grounds of incorrect dates and continued to pay the rent. We were not going to be forced out and subjected to costs or inconvenience due to their incompetence. The weather had improved and the house was drying out for the summer and we would tough it out now – having gone through the worst. We have since redecorated all damp affected walls as it is unnecessary to be reminded every day.
Our MP has pushed for resolution; this has mustered a stronger letter from the EHO. There has been no response other than a second section 21 notice. The dates are once again incorrect. The letting agent has put our deposit into a DPS but did not provide the Deposit Protection Certificate or prescribed information until we requested it after five months of tenancy. The prescribed information appears to be incomplete. I doubt that any s21 is valid until deposit is returned and the landlord might be liable for 3x under the Localism Act? Our claim should also be for a reduction in rent back-dated to 11/2012 and should provide compensation for immense stress and upset – particularly to my wife – for the repeated inconvenience, small damage, etc.
We’ve spoken with experts in Landlord/Tenant issues, they’ve seen our file which is very complete and have passed it onto Barristers to evaluate. We have a strong case apparently, but would incur costs of circa £7k to seek compensation/enforcement of duty to repair; we’ve been told that there is little likelihood of being awarded costs – if successful. That’s an expensive ‘point of principle’ for us.
It seems a dreadful situation. We actually like the house and the worst of the problems could be so easily resolved. We must now consider vacating the property before the bad weather sets in again – to remain longer would weaken any case against the landlord and the letting agent. The landlord is inexperienced and his conduct and concern for our welfare has been quite despicable. The promises that he made to my wife and I were instantly forgotten and we would like to do whatever might be done, so that he is taught the lesson.
Please accept our apologies for the long post, is there anything that we could do, other than what the landlord and letting agent expects – that being to vacate and walk away? I feel that someone needs to make a stand here, to create some solid case law if necessary – to protect others faced with similar problems in the future.
Thanks in advance
Roy and Tania
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Jay James
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Sign Up20:37 PM, 18th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Reply to the comment left by "Jay Jay" at "18/08/2013 - 20:36":
(re above comment; I am not a legal expert)
Jay James
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Sign Up20:40 PM, 18th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Reply to the comment left by "Jay Jay" at "18/08/2013 - 20:36":
some research may be a good idea to check the following term.
I believe the term may be "voidable" by the innocent party.
In any case, you can exit the contract on the basis that the LL has broken the contract
Ben Reeve-Lewis
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Sign Up21:02 PM, 18th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Wooah there. This is very dangerous advice and completely wrong in law. One party breaching a contract DOES NOT void a contract. This is nonsense.
The many and numerous possible breaches to the many and numerous types of contract leave each party open to take legal action against the other party for either breach of contract, breach of tort or criminal oofences, not to merely renege on the contract. This isnt the school playground here and to follow this advice could well leave both parties tied up in expensive and lengthy litigation.
The majority of my time spent in tenancy enforcement is taken up because so many landlords and tenants hold similar naive views. No party can just walk away because the other called foul.
Jay James
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Sign Up21:24 PM, 18th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Reply to the comment left by "Ben Reeve-Lewis" at "18/08/2013 - 21:02":
Suggestion of school playground not appreciated.
I did correct myself to voidable not void.
Still, your right Ben, it was rash of me to say all that.
Thank you for correcting me.
--
It would have been better to suggest that Roy and Tania ask what they could do about the breaches by the LL.
Perhaps asking someone like yourself.
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Query, does a significant breach make it possible not to just walk away from a rental contract with no further action, but to end the contract somehow?
--
Roy and Tania
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Sign Up23:11 PM, 18th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Reply to the comment left by "Ben Reeve-Lewis" at "18/08/2013 - 21:02":
Thanks Ben. We took a lot of advice from Shelter, CAB and a solicitor on this. Even though the LL (in this case the LL on behalf of the LA) was negligent, it did not give us the right to walk away.
Late Nov to early Feb were very miserable times for us in this property. We have come out stronger as a result and have a strong case to answer - we believe. We have taken advice from one of the legal references that Ben mentioned in a very early post and have now spoken to new solicitors locally (as recommended by that reference - thanks Giles 😉 ).
It looks like we'll be serving an LBA in the next week. Whilst the thought of standing up in court doesn't exactly fill us with joy, this is an argument that we must win - then we can move on.
Ben Reeve-Lewis
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Sign Up5:46 AM, 19th August 2013, About 11 years ago
@ Jay Jay No, neither landlord nor tenant can just walk away from a contract. Even a verbal contract (no written tenancy agreement) is binding because much of what goes on between landlord and tenant is governed by statute. The contractual clauses are merely the icing on the cake as it were, not the be all and end all of it. In not carrying out the repairs Roy and Tania's landlord is breaking the law.
I spoke to them about this on the phone last week.
Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118
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Sign Up7:21 AM, 19th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Reply to the comment left by "Roy and Tania" at "18/08/2013 - 23:11":
Good morning Roy.
For the benefit of other readers, I assume your reference to an LBA is "letter Before Action", also known as a pre-action protocol letter?
My understanding is this is notice to the landlord that you intend to enter into litigation, is this correct?
This being the case, would you mind disclosing, for the benefit of our readers the amount you are going to be claiming and the reasons for these claims please? I understand that you have to prove "quantum" which is a basis upon which you have calculated the damages which you have incurred. I would be very interested to understand how much you are going to sue your landlord for and the basis of quantum.
Last but not least, did you manage to find a lawyer who would take the case on a CFA "Conditional Fee Agreement", commonly known as "no win no fee".
Thanks in advance for your reply.
This thread will demonstrate to other landlords reading it why it is important to be a GOOD landlord, i.e. to understand the law and the importance of providing safe accommodation and a professional relationship with tenants. It will also help tenants in your position to know that bad landlords can't just get away with these things.
Many thanks Roy, I look forward to reading your response and I wish you well with your case. Bad landlords earn GOOD landlords a bad reputation. They fail to comply with regulations and it is good landlords who end up paying for enforcement and additional layers of regulation. That is why GOOD Landlords dislike bad landlords almost as much as they dislike bad tenants.
.
andrew townshend
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Sign Up11:00 AM, 19th August 2013, About 11 years ago
i had asked earlier why these tenants had not left, given that the landlord had broken his side of the contract, i would have thought this quite reasonable, however it would seem i am wrong here, i stand corrected. but i am a little confused in that the landlord has issued section 21 notices, all be it incorrectly dated, isn't this an invitation from the landlord to terminate this contract, would it not make sense to grab this invitation with both hands and move on?
Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118
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Sign Up11:30 AM, 19th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Reply to the comment left by "andrew townshend" at "19/08/2013 - 11:00":
I think you may be missing the point Andrew. Roy and Tanya like the house and they don't want to move. They just wanted the landlord to fix it. When he didn't do that they complained and the landlord retaliated by trying to evict them. It's a point of principle for them now. They are being stubborn to teach the landlord a lesson, i.e. that he must keep his promises, maintain his property and respect his tenants. Retaliatory eviction is bad business. I totally support them. Bad landlords get good landlords a bad name and give authorities excuses to pile more layers of regulation and costs onto our businesses. This is also bad for tenants as these costs result in increase rents. Good landlords need to unite with good tenants to drive the baddies out.
Roy, please correct me if I have misunderstood or missed anything.
.
Roy and Tania
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Sign Up11:46 AM, 19th August 2013, About 11 years ago
Reply to the comment left by "Mark Alexander" at "19/08/2013 - 11:30":
absolutely spot on for us Mark! Also we have made our own investment in the property (as originally advertised). Its not convenient for us and our business to keep moving and we carefully sought what we believed would be a long rental for us until our business will stand on its own feet.
there are hidden costs for tenants having to constantly move through no fault of their own: moving costs, those horrible inflated LA admin fees, schooling upheaval and of course - potentially affected credit.
good landlords and good tenants were of course - made for each other.
Mark, can we answer your previous question later? we will update in full as we have more detail.