Rental Income – Father & Son

Rental Income – Father & Son

11:54 AM, 25th May 2015, About 10 years ago 17

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I have a few queries I was hoping someone maybe able to help with. Rental Income - Father & Son

I am 27 years old and currently looking to purchase a two/three bedroom house in London potentially with the mindset of renting out one or two of the other rooms, whilst also still living in the property myself. To do this, my dad was actually going to help me by either buying with me or gifting me some of the money to make this possible, i.e. circa £100k whilst I would put in a smaller deposit and then take a mortgage out of the rest. It seems due to his age (61) and lack of income (other than final salary pension) that we would struggle to get a joint mortgage, or at least a mortgage of 25 + years.

Therefore it seems that him gifting the money would be the most realistic solution (although I understand there maybe IHT issues if he dies within 7 years due to the gift being a PET. What I would like to know is if it is only me who takes out the mortgage – Can my father then receive any rental income on any rental profits that come in as a result of renting out two of the rooms or would it be me that would need to receive them due to taking out the mortgage (and therefore being listed on the deeds).

The alternate would be me to receive the rental income and then make payments to him – however I have concerns over HMRC might view this – i.e. Was this actually a loan arrangement and these are repayments, or alternatively am I allowed to gift back money, or would this be seen as gift with reservation – i.e. my father gave me the capital to purchase the property and then I am giving him back rental income which he benefits from.

Can anyone advise – or if they have any other bright ideas on my whole situation.

Thanks

Alex Ward


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Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118

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15:19 PM, 27th May 2015, About 10 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Alexander Ward" at "27/05/2015 - 14:29":

An investment would be when your parents own a stake in the property, e.g. if the property cost £300,000 and they invested £100,000 you may agree between you that they get 33% of the net sale proceeds of the property by an agreed date. You may also agree that they get 33% of the rental income.

The above figures are for guidance only. Basically you can agree whatever split you like.

Your parents do not need to be on the legal title or the mortgage to own a stake in the beneficial interest of the property, as described above. The mortgage and the legal title can be in your name only and the beneficial interest (as described above) can be documented in a Declaration of Trust.
.

Alexander Ward

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18:08 PM, 27th May 2015, About 10 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Mark Alexander" at "27/05/2015 - 15:19":

Sorry to mention. Again, perhaps a fault of mine in not going into enough detail when initially transcribing my scenarIo. Ideally when my parents come to want the money it would be great if they could also receive the capital growth on any investment gain it has made as well. It sounds like that is possible as you have outlined above and presumably that is something that is quite common and mortgage lenders are happy to accept that too?

Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118

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18:14 PM, 27th May 2015, About 10 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Alexander Ward" at "27/05/2015 - 18:08":

Lenders are only interested in the Legal Title, a Declaration of Trust has no effect on legal title.

Therefore, the scenario I outlined in my last reply seems best suited to your requirements.

My previous referrals are those I would recommend to put the arrangements in place for you.
.

Alexander Ward

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13:44 PM, 28th May 2015, About 10 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Mark Alexander" at "27/05/2015 - 18:14":

So with the loan agreement, my parents would still be entitled to any capital gain as well?

I thought this would only be applicable to an investment?

Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118

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17:29 PM, 28th May 2015, About 10 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Alexander Ward" at "28/05/2015 - 13:44":

That would depend on the terms of the loan agreement.
.

Alexander Ward

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14:49 PM, 11th June 2015, About 10 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Mark Alexander" at "28/05/2015 - 17:29":

Great - Thanks Mark.

I have been in touch with Howard and I'll be speaking with Neal Barlow soon as well.

So my understanding is that with a loan agreement my parents just get more protection whilst with the investment they don't? Or is it possible that they can have a legal claim if the investment goes down the pan?

I have a couple of other questions -

Presumably if it was an investment, the bank would have no problems or questions with me having an extra large deposit, i.e. another £100k. Would they not ask questions about this or would I just state this was an investment.

Secondly, if it was a loan, the bank would want to see an agreement whereby I would have to pay my parents back this money over x number of years. If that was the case, wouldn't this affect my ability to borrow as much money from the bank in the first place?

Finally - in relation to the second question, who is to question that I am actually paying the loan back (other than my parents). Presumably this is just my parents - i.e. if they have a problem with it that is when they can seek legal advice and potentially make a claim against me?

Thanks

Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118

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15:03 PM, 11th June 2015, About 10 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Alexander Ward" at "11/06/2015 - 14:49":

Hi Alex

With respect I'm going to step back at this stage, especially as it this is unpaid Consultancy work. This discussion has gone far beyond forum level now and is very personal to you.

Neil at Pacific and their in-house legal adviser will be able to advise you from here, along with Howard of course.
.

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