Lodger or tenant?

Lodger or tenant?

9:12 AM, 3rd July 2024, About 6 months ago 23

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Hello all, I have ended up in court with the lodger as they refuse to leave after the notice to quit expired.  In court on the 16th May the judge accepted my arguments on the facts that they were lodgers.

However, the lodgers rejected this claim and were given until July 10th, to present evidence supporting their argument, as they were not prepared at the time.

I have a few questions: How could they prove the claim that they are not lodgers?, What happens if the judge agrees with them?, What will my options be?

To provide more context: there were initially three lodgers, but one left last August. The remaining two refuse to move and have not been paying rent. They stay in their rooms with other people, have changed the locks, and one of them recently gave birth. She is now living in the room with her baby and boyfriend.

Thanks for any advice,

Flore


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Flore-anne Nevry

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18:49 PM, 5th July 2024, About 6 months ago

Reply to the comment left by DPT at 05/07/2024 - 18:29
I have lived in the property for "ever"until 2020 when I was offer the job,the two lodgers lived with me from 2018 until I left for the job overseas and was in and out of the country as explain earlier.

As for the legal advice,yes I have a lawyer
At first I did the paper work with him serving a S8 for non payment of rent and anti social behaviour however a day before court in May the barrister who was going to "fight the case decided that it was more of a lodger/resident landlord there the S8 was not needed
The judge accepted is claim but because the lodgers had no defence on the "lodger" and refute that their were lodgers the judge allow us to amend our case and ask them to bring prove of why they think their are not lodgers
Court is now for the 21.08.24

Judith Wordsworth

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10:09 AM, 6th July 2024, About 6 months ago

Jonathan Willis has given you excellent advice re criteria for lodgers.

But

Did you declare the rent your “lodgers” paid you to HMRC?

Is any “lodger” being declared under the government’s Rent a Room Scheme?

Are all the bills and Council tax in your sole name? Are you paying the gas, water & electricity in full while you are not there ? Have you told your building insurance company in writing that you have lodgers?

Who does the cleaning of ALL the rooms including the bedrooms? Who provides the bedding? Who is responsible for laundering?

Are there locks on ALL the bedroom doors? Lodgers bedrooms do not usually have locks as locks can give exclusive use to the room.

You say 1 tenant is hoping to be re-housed by the Local Authority. Lodgers do not get re-housed, I believe, only tenants do. What did she declare as her status as on the application form? A If you took deposits from your “lodgers” and they are deemed tenants you find yourself being counter claimed for not protecting them. lodger or a tenant? Is the father of her child also on the application form? Using your address? What status ie lodger or tenant?

Did you take any deposits? Lodger deposits do not need to be protected. If you took deposits from your “lodgers” and they are deemed tenants you may find yourself being counter claimed for not protecting them.

That you have stated you have also have an EPC in place weighs more heavily towards tenants and not lodgers. You do not need an EPC for lodgers, nor do you need an EICR.

Only a home owners gas safety certificate is needed for having lodgers, not a landlords gas safety certificate. They are exactly the same thing but headed differently.

But honestly everything you have stated, and not being harsh but realistic, I think a judge is likely to come to the conclusion they are tenants and that you saw an opportunity to rent out rooms in a house you rarely frequented, for whatever reason, without any required documentation in place.

KD South East

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10:51 AM, 6th July 2024, About 6 months ago

As someone who has had both lodgers and tenants, I think you have a fairly good case to say they are lodgers, as you lived with them for 2 years before going abroad for work.
If the friend who stayed in your room paid you rent, that may cause issues.
A 'notice to quit' is sufficient for local authorities to have a homelessness duty, as it is virtually impossible to persuade the homeowner to let the lodger remain.
Your lodgers should have taken that directly to the council. Although many councils give bad advice.
Not paying rent means that the lodgers could be seen as making themselves 'intentionally homeless', and the council may choose not to help them, but with a baby that is unlikely - as long as they are entitled to LA assistance.

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