I had to pay one day’s council tax?

I had to pay one day’s council tax?

9:49 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago 39

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Hello, North Norfolk district council is charging me one day’s council tax because the tenant moved out at 11am on the 9 /8/23. The new tenant moved in on the 10/8/23.

As the tenant didn’t sleep at the house on the 9/9/23, I’ve got to pay one day’s council tax – this don’t seem right.

I’ve told the council they will get no more info from me in the future – and he said ‘more work for the girls in the office’.

Thoughts?

Paul


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Judith Wordsworth

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10:10 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

I’m sorry but this is absolutely correct that you are legally responsible for the 1 days Council Tax charge.

The utilities serving the property are also your responsibility for the 24 hours between tenants ie standing charge for any meters and any units used.

They are an allowable expense to be set against income from property on your tax return.

All part and parcel of being a landlord

Robert

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10:14 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

I had the same (actually 2 days). I am sure Councils used to give a weeks grace, that has now been scrapped. Also they get more for an empt property where they provide no services, than a property with one person (with maybe children) where they provide services. I had a property completely wrecked by a tenant with utilities cut off. It took me 8 months to get back to a liveable standard and the council said that was no their problem and happily charge me full councilt tax.

John Lettings

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10:14 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

I've had this issue before. I believe what is relevant is the date from which the tenancy agreement became active, in your case either the 9th or 10th August.
If it was the 9th, then the tenant is liable for the council tax from that day and you are not, irrespective of whether they were there for the night.
If it was the 10th, then I'm afraid you would be liable for that one day.
Technically the same is also true for the gas/electric and water!
Sometimes a short gap between tenants can be handy, for example if there are maintenance issues to address before a new tenant.
I've overcome this irritating admin burden by agreeing with a tenant a formal date from which the tenancy agreement is agreed to align with the exit of the previous tenant even if they actually move in a day or two later, but have allowed a reduction in the first month's rent or a small refund to compensate. They also generally like this as its allowed them to start moving items in early, spreading their move over a few days.

Jon

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10:24 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

There is Tribunal precedent for this Paul - Council Tax liability applies to whomever is the occupier 'at midnight' on any given day. If your tenancy actually ended at 11.00am then you are indeed liable for one day of Council Tax. There is however, debate about whether midnight is the final moment of a day, or the very beginning of a new day, or even both! Tribunal appears to accept that it is the final moment of a day. Most tenancies run until midnight and so end 'after midnight' - i.e the tenant has the right to occupy for the full day right up to and potentially including midnight - but at the instant of midnight, they must be gone - so it is a little like Schrodinger's cat - are they in occupation, or not. I always tell The Council that the tenancy ended 'after midnight' on the relevant date - moving out earlier does not of itself end the tenancy, it depends on what is written in the tenancy agreement. The Council I mostly deal with (Bristol) still often get this wrong but I just manually deduct one day from the payment (if anything at all is due), or in your case I just ignore it, they are very unlikely to pursue a debt for one day and you will get a reminder if so - just message them to tell them you don't owe it and then let them stew. I believe the law was written only with home owners / movers in mind - where it is normal for a completion to take place in the middle of the day - and it is the new owner, not the seller, who is liable for Council Tax on that day. Our esteemed lawmakers do not appear to have considered how their wording might affect the rented sector..... It is reassuring to be governed by such thoughtful and informed people.

Yvonne Francis

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10:30 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

I've been caught up in this and the general principal was, whoever holds the key at midnignt is responsible for rhe tax for the previous day. It is generally assumed tenants will hand their keys in on the end day so the Landlord or agent will hold the keys at midnight. I must confess, and I have let properties for over forty years, in most cases the council do not bother.

Kent Landlord

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10:32 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

Same story in Kent I had a tenant drag their heels moving out finally got the keys back at 9pm even though they should have been out by midday !!
Argued the toss with the council mainly because the tenant had been troublesome ( right to the end !!) and got nowhere.........

Ron H-W

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10:39 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

Before 10 years or so ago (01 April 2013), there'd be no charge if the property was unoccupied AND UNFURNISHED, but things have changed.
For the next 2 years, there would be no charge for the first 14 days (of being unoccupied AND UNFURNISHED), but in most places even that has disappeared - though Ealing is one exception. See e.g.:
https://www.ealing.gov.uk/info/201260/empty_and_unoccupied_properties/1488/apply_for_an_empty_property_discount
https://www.kingston.gov.uk/council-tax/information-owners
BTW, I think some would regard the guy's comment as sexist.

Anyway, does this tax-deductible amount (about £4 for band A, £6 for band D or £12 for band H) really matter, in the greater scheme of things? You will probably have put more than £12 worth of effort into writing this question and handling the responses ...

john isaacs

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10:39 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

I had this where the old tenant moved out and the new tenant moved in the same day , I took the keys off the old tenant and gave them right away to the new tenant and I had a bill for one day council tax ! I did not pay it and never heard any more from it

John Hayes

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10:41 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

I've also had this recently with North Yorks Council. The bill was for 1 day (£4.05) printed out and sent to me by post, this probably cost them at least £5 with postage and admin. I deliberately payed them by cheque which would have cost them more money in admin and bank fees.... Gave me some satisfaction!

These people are clueless and wouldn't survive in the real world.

Ron H-W

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10:47 AM, 18th August 2023, About A year ago

Reply to the comment left by Robert at 18/08/2023 - 10:14
Robert - If you are one of at least 2 chargeable adults occupying your home, you should perhaps have "moved in" to the property for the duration of that 8-month refurbishment - and got the 25% single-occupier discount. And, if there were exactly 2 chargeable adults normally occupying your home, then that would also have been entitled to the 25% discount.
"Half a loaf", as they say ...
An idea for next time? (but hopefully it won't happen again)

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