Gas cert labelled AT RISK but legislation doesn’t condemn?

I got an "At Risk" tag recently, from British Gas, because in his opinion there weren't enough ceiling inspection hatches to see all the flue. This despite the fact that two previous B Gas safety certificates had been issued for the installation.

The wording on the tag is "In the interests of safety please do not use it until the faults are remedied", which seems calculated to sound frightening. B Gas just need to cover themselves, on a corporate and individual basis.

The installation is either dangerous, in which case it would be condemned/disabled, or its not.

Gunga Din

I see two options here:

1. Fit a secondary control valve as per recommendations.

2. Get another engineer (your own) to carry out a safety check.

The second may not result in the desired outcome but it is worth a try. If the tenant does have 24 hour access to the valve I don't see the issue, but the engineer is probably thinking that this access could be removed and if it was it would be dangerous, so they may have a point.

Its agreed that Gas Safe are USELESS. - They give similar responses as HSE, -its quite disappointing that regulatory bodies won't committ themselves but happy to condemn others.
I'd change the Agent as well, as they seem less than helpful. Some agents forget they are Employed by and act for that person - The Landlord, and are Not an autonomous body.

Too much is open to ambiguity for Gas Safe certs, and if the gas engineer is having a bad day... and of course they have to cover their arxxs just in case so they go overboard, plus there is the upside for them as creating more work for themselves..

I had one recently who wasn't happy with the pointing around the flue so the boiler failed and had a sticker placed on it and I received a quote for over £200 to rectify, so I re-pointed it myself much to their distain. On closer examination the pointing was pretty sound, a bit loose at best under the rubber wall gasket so really it was a very very marginal fail.

However just get a isco valve installed and put it to bed....

I guess my main issue here is that we are governed by those who have a vested interest in creating more work.

They assume omnipotence and a backing by their personal version of legislation.

Who do we turn to when an engineer obviously can't remember, or doesn't actually know, or can't read the legislation? Gas Safe of course, but they prove to be as stated USELESS. Lol

I've had another recent issue where an engineer didn't pass a cert because the flue was sticking out too far from the building and was supposedly too close to the boundary. On investigation of the building regs I found him to be completely wrong. The regs say 600mm from a boundary and this is at least 1000mm. When I raised this he said 'oh yeah, umm you are right but umm, I just don't like the look of it so could you cut it back? When I said no, there is no need, he just said he'd refund the charge. Which he did actually.

So how is it that we can be policed by such incompetence? There is obviously not enough control on who can and is able to deal with the legislative side and leaving it to whether a particular engineer 'likes it' or not is surely not acceptable. Point perfectly made by Gunga Din and others above above on the inconsistency we suffer in their work.

I take it as no one sees it as a problem to leave an imnstallation as At Risk, so long as with some common sense it is only so because of a bureaucratic change and not a technical problem, and it's safe (as it has been for 30 years). Otherwise there ought to be a public statement about bringing all installations up to current standard, and then every other property of mine would have to have this work done.

I seem to go through gas 'engineers' every year.........

A second valve needs to be in the property ( or outside) if the first valve is so many meters away from the property (I think approximately 10 meters) this usually only effects flats, i.e 2nd floor and above. Gas safe use technical bulletins, for old regulations only as s guide and it's down to the discretion of the gas engineer to either make an advisory note or put at risk. Most will put at risk, because their gas safe licence may be revoked and they could lose there livelihood, in the event of a gas accident, with the last engineers name and number will be all over the gas certificate. Personally I would have a second vale installed as per recommendation, you'll have peace of mind, your tenant can isolate the gas in the home and you won't have this issue rise again next year. I doubt It will break the bank. They will cut an existing gas pipe and install a lever/ tap in between the continuous pipe work nearer the boiler.. Shouldn't take long problems solved.... your then be up to date with current regs...

Reply to the comment left by "Adam Withford" at "29/03/2017 - 19:13":

Bit like the judiciary really, same case two different judges two different outcomes...But very little recourse for the victim when the judge gets it wrong......The wife has the same issue on occasion, some Friday's its fine to go to the pub as she can't wait to see the back of me the following Friday I'm lambasted for going...!

Reply to the comment left by "Paul Green" at "30/03/2017 - 00:09":

Hi Paul,

Actually the regs are within 6m from an appliance.

As I said, it now calassifies how many properties in the UK 'At Risk'?

This is just a very badly approached regulatory system which is inconsistent and open for biased opinion.

My response below is completely out of topic but something I strongly believe in:

Individuals who turn up to install, repair or certify gas systems shouldn't be called Gas Engineers - they are technicians. They do not 'engineer' anything and it leads to the disrespect of many who have struggled through several years of University malarkey to be called an Engineer!

I once wrote to British Gas and their then CEO responded to confirm plans to change the terminology in all their customer-facing businesses. But four years down the road, and they still call them Gas Engineers!!

I appreciate the title is not protected in the UK but if the usage is understood, it will help with those who do end up becoming Professional Engineers 🙂

As a Chartered Engineer myself Mervin, I feel your pain. The worst example was this job advert I saw in a FreeAds paper:

"Upholstery Engineer Wanted to repair used furniture. No experience necessary. Full driving license desirable."

!!!