Are freehold ground rents a good investment?

Are freehold ground rents a good investment?

17:38 PM, 31st July 2013, About 11 years ago 43

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I have just started investing in property.Are Freehold Ground Rent Investments a good investment?

Living overseas, I have been unable to get a U.K. mortgage so I have had to pay cash for my first property.

I have a good rental yield of 10.1%, but obviously no leverage for now. I am arranging more business commitments in U.K. to eventually remedy the mortgage problem.

My question is this:

I have been looking at, but not buying, Freehold Ground Investments which I often see available:

For example, £3,000 buys the freehold ground rent for 125 year (or less) leases paying £300 per year (S5(b) Notices have been served under the Landlord & Tenant Act 1987). Not a lot of money each year, but still 10% yield.

My question is this. Would a portfolio of these types of investments qualify for a loan for reinvestment into buy to lets?

The 10% yield from the Freehold Ground Investments could be used to pay off this initial loan.

For example, £400,000 invested in freehold ground rents should produce £40,000 per year.

A 75% LTV would be £300,000 which you could pay back using the ground rent income of £40.000 pounds per year.

Use the £300.000 as £30,000 75% buy to let (for example) deposits on 10 houses (or go up north and buy 8 for cash, then re-mortgage, or whatever the permutation gives most yield???).

The 10 properties, if bought wisely could be refurbished re-valued as usual to earn the required yield. The debt would be paid by the freehold ground rent investments.

I know you could just use the initial £400,000 pounds direct into property but the freehold ground rents look to be low maintenance no void investments. Their value rises as time passes and looking (as I am) to leave the property portfolio for future generations, so long as the yields are good, the investment vehicle (within the property portfolio) is just a money generating wealth creating exercise, and one day, someone will be grateful for present day foresight.

I would appreciate comments regards Freehold Ground Investments and the possibility to obtain loans using them for the purchase of properties.

Thanks

Christopher Farrell


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Puzzler

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23:44 PM, 7th August 2013, About 11 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Annette Stone" at "03/08/2013 - 22:40":

That is interesting: are you saying that a B2L leaseholder has fewer rights than an owner/occupier? does that only occur at the end of the term or might it apply during lease extension negotiations, right to purchase or right to manage. Why would that make a difference?

Annette Stone

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2:15 AM, 8th August 2013, About 11 years ago

The legislation seems to make it clear that only occupies could claim a tenancy if a lease expired. Have a look and see what you can find on the subject and I would be interested to hear what you find. I assume this is really rare

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8:43 AM, 11th August 2013, About 11 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Christopher Farrell" at "31/07/2013 - 18:59":
Have also been looking at ground rents . The developers who can give you a new build clean deal will not give you 10%.
Therefore risk and reward will definitely come into play here

Sam Wong

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9:00 AM, 11th August 2013, About 11 years ago

Although there may be other income/profit possibilities, ground rent investments are effectively fixed income instruments similar to bonds or gilts albeit normally with a built in escalator over a long period of time. Since interest rate can only go up from current level, would this be a good time to consider this kind of investment ?

Jonathan Leci

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16:19 PM, 24th September 2013, About 11 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Mark Alexander" at "31/07/2013 - 17:46":

Following the discussions posted, I work with a fund that gives 7% fixed return on ground rent investment (and shares the profit from the insurance, management of the property etc) or has an agreement with the banks (which value the property) and will give a loan of upto 65% on the value of the property - being geared the returns get as high as 15%.

Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118

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16:28 PM, 24th September 2013, About 11 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Jonathan Leci" at "24/09/2013 - 16:19":

Hi Jonathan

I have removed your email address from your comment on the basis that soliciting for business is not allowed. However, we do allow business sponsors to have logo's email addresses, telephone numbers and a link to their website in their member profiles, please see http://www.property118.com/business-sponsorship/

I am personally very interested to learn more.
.

Annette Stone

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16:33 PM, 24th September 2013, About 11 years ago

Jonathan. Like Mark I am very interested to learn more about the funding aspect for ground rents as I have two clients with large portfolios with whom we may be able to do some business. I would also be interested to learn whether the 7% return investment fund is after management fees and whether there is any disclaimer to state that investments can go down as well as up. If you could let Mark have your e mail details I can be in direct contact

Mark Alexander - Founder of Property118

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7:57 AM, 25th September 2013, About 11 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Annette Stone" at "24/09/2013 - 16:33":

Hello Annette

Jonathan has emailed me offline and it appears that he is selling shares in a form of collective investment fund which purchases freehold ground rents from what I can gather. He says the 7% return is what he's averaged but it's not guaranteed. He also says they can get 65% gearing on the investments and that's the bit I'm really interested in - i.e. who is the lender?

I still know nothing more about his company but I would have thought he would need to be regulated by the FCA (nee FSA) and display this on his business stationery, as your employers do, to undertake this type of activity.

I have responded to Jonathan to ask him who the lender is and it will be interesting to see what he comes back with.

NOTE TO JONATHAN - if you are reading this post, please comment on what I have said. Have I understood your business model correctly?
.

Annette Stone

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9:05 AM, 25th September 2013, About 11 years ago

On the button as usual Mark but I would also like him to let us know how the properties are being valued because it is quite possible to have ground rent income of £100K per year and properties (including reversionary values) worth £10m. So is it going to be 65% of the ground rent or the property value and what will happen if you sell one of the freeholds or a lease extension - do all the proceeds have to go to reduce the loan and how is this going to be policed? Also the big money question - what's the interest rate? If it's a major Bank doing this it's certainly passed me by as the big four are certainly not interested

Jonathan Leci

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10:50 AM, 25th September 2013, About 11 years ago

Reply to the comment left by "Annette Stone" at "25/09/2013 - 09:05":

In order to ear the average return it is advised to invest for a period of five years. The investment is in the ground rents so if and when one wants to sell it will be necessary to find a buyer

The fund is currently in the process to be regulated by the FCA.

The loan is from a UK major bank and the 65% loan is based on the banks valuation

I will be happy to share more details if you contact me directly

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