9:50 AM, 28th March 2024, About 8 months ago 45
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A landlord has warned that “tenants will suffer the most” if new legislation and regulations get the green light.
Mick Roberts, one of Nottingham’s largest landlords told Property118 about the harsh realities facing both sides of the rental divide.
He also says selective licensing is causing chaos for landlords in Nottingham.
Mr Robert’s journey as a landlord has led him to become one of Nottingham’s largest landlords accommodating benefit tenants, though this wasn’t his original plan.
He explained to Property118: “I officially started in 1997. The first house I purchased was for a friend who was struggling to find suitable accommodation for his family.
“They were living in a cramped flat, so I decided to buy a house and rent it to them.
“The mortgage amounted to £150 a month, and I charged them £300 a month for rent. That’s how I got my start in the private rented sector.”
He adds: “It wasn’t initially my intention to house benefit tenants. Tenants were desperate, and I gained a reputation for accepting anyone.
“Before I knew it, my tenants were spreading the word to their friends. I also related to the tenants because we were on the same wavelength.”
Mr Roberts decided to stop buying any more houses in 2004 but got coerced to buy more houses in 2008 by letting agents.
He explains: “I originally didn’t want any of the houses I bought in 2008 but the letting agents were begging me to buy them.
“The agents couldn’t sell them because of the financial crash in 2008 and just could not give houses away. The agents were selling for half price, so I decided it made financial sense to buy them.”
Mr Roberts says he has now stopped buying houses to help tenants since Nottingham City Council introduced its first selective licensing scheme in 2018.
He told Property118 that many landlords in Nottingham have been selling up because of selective licensing.
“Since the licensing scheme has been introduced it’s been making me go crackers” he said.
“It is true that the licensing scheme has found some bad houses. However, the majority of houses have now got worse as landlords are spending the funds they did have on the licensing scheme.”
He added: “A lot of landlords have had enough now and are selling up because of licensing. It’s not rocket science if you’re faced with spending £900 on a licence fee or needing to invest £3,000 in renovating a tenant’s kitchen, you simply can’t afford to do the kitchen because the council takes the money.
“That’s what we’ve found out about licensing it’s more paperwork and made landlords more selective when choosing tenants.”
He adds: “The problem is licensing has forced a lot of retrospective changes on tenants when they’ve already lived there for 20 years.
“For example, I’ve got a 68-year-old tenant who has been with me for 21 years but licensing now says I must inspect the property. Why do we have to do that – is she not trustworthy?
“What licensing should do is say to landlords, ‘Any new houses you buy or any new tenants you get, you will be subject to these conditions’ rather than it being retrospective.”
When approached by Property118, Nottingham City Council claimed that the licensing scheme does not generate any profits.
“We had to make an evidence-driven case to the government over selective licensing which was firmly based on the legislation and guidance.
This was approved by the Secretary of State to run in certain areas of Nottingham. Selective licensing is not income-generating – councils are not designed to make a profit. Licence fees solely cover the cost of setting up, operating and delivering the scheme in the city.”
Mick also told Property118 that the negative stereotypes of landlords by the media are not helping tenants in the private rented sector.
He explains: “It’s self-programming, isn’t it? You automatically think of Mr Bad Landlord. However, when you cut a landlord’s choice away then many landlords are simply going to say, ‘I’m not going to give you the home in the first place’.
“Since 2015, when George Osborne introduced Section 24, it’s snowballed as many landlords are simply not making a profit.”
He adds: “Why are tenant groups like Generation Rent and Shelter calling for legislation like the Renters (Reform) Bill which is going to ban Section 21?
“This is obviously going to cut supply as landlords will leave and tenants won’t be able to get anywhere. People need to stop assuming that all landlords charge a fortune because a lot of us aren’t.”
Mr Roberts adds he wishes to sell many of his properties but is unable to due to his tenants.
He explains: “I wish to sell a lot of my properties but can’t as, my tenants can’t get anywhere. Some of us have morals and a conscience, but also I’m not going to last forever.
“During my interview with Radio 5 last year, the discussion revolved around the basic human right to have somewhere to live. While I acknowledged this right, I raised the question: should it solely be the landlord’s responsibility to ensure everyone has a home?”
“Why should I continue to be a charity, I’ve had no holidays and worked 16-hour days for many years as a landlord trying to do my best.”
Mr Roberts adds the government needs to listen to landlords to help them stay in the private rented sector.
He said: “We are the ones supplying the houses for the market. The government should be coming to landlords saying, ‘What can we do for you because you are all selling up?
“I would say to the government ‘come and talk to my tenants and ask them what they would like’. There’s no communication from the government at all, they just listen to a few groups who think all landlords are bad with bad houses when in reality we are not.”
Mr Roberts says he would like the government to change Universal Credit. He says he has now stopped accepting benefit tenants because of the UC system.
He said: “I’ve stopped taking benefit tenants now not because of them but because of the Universal Credit system.
“Universal Credit is great in many ways, but the direct payment is a massive problem. If a tenant hasn’t paid, then there’s a safety net to say the tenant is in arrears.
“Very often they are just reverting payment back to the tenant and it’s making people homeless.”
A Department of Work and Pensions spokesperson told Property118: “Claimants on Universal Credit are expected to pay their own housing costs out of their monthly Universal Credit award. This helps to reduce welfare dependency by mirroring the world of work.
“Direct payments are considered for claimants who are unable to manage their single monthly payment, and as a result are at risk of financial harm. Once set up, direct payments can only be removed at the request of a claimant if it is deemed to be in the claimant’s best interests.”
Mr Roberts highlights that organisations like Citizens Advice tend to receive a one-sided narrative from certain tenants.
This can result in policies, like advocating for EPC C ratings for rented properties, which may not address the needs of all tenants.
He told Property118: “Citizens Advice are generally really good but they are misunderstanding the situation for some tenants.
“The good tenants, enjoying a cosy home with a new boiler, have little reason to reach out to Citizens Advice. This creates a skewed perception among renters groups, as they primarily hear from those facing issues.
“Then suddenly, tenants are told: ‘We’re tearing apart your nicely decorated home to install insulation in the walls and floorboards, saving you £30 per month on gas and electric bills.’
“Citizens Advice don’t realise that a tenant’s original cheap rent of £600 will go up to £900 just to save a tenant £30 on their utility bills.
“Citizens Advice think that all tenants are being ripped off as they only hear from the aggrieved ones. The government are forcing retrospective changes on us when in reality the majority of tenants don’t have a problem. “
Mr Roberts says the future of the private rented sector looks set to get worse.
He said: “I think it’s either going to get worse for another 10 years or it’s going to take 10 years to turn it around.
“Landlords are just not trusting anyone at all now, and at the end of the day it will be the tenants that suffer the most.”
To find out more about Mick Robert’s thoughts on selective licensing and what he thinks will happen if a Labour government is elected, watch the video below.
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Stuart Graham
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Sign Up12:40 PM, 29th March 2024, About 8 months ago
I have 1 house which I rent out need to sell now as mortgage is £900 but rent only £600 mortgage has doubled in last 16 months
Advised tenant last July needs to sell or put rent up to cover said was disgusted with me !
When they moved in she was working but now on UC stopped paying me as soon as advised putting up for sale had to issue section 8 when 2 months in arrears as section 21 didn't deposit in scheme my fault but this was my family house only moved due to needing child in specialist school
After 2 months arrears managed to get rent paid directly to me but has now stopped as of last month no reason giving
got court case November last year and granted possession order then had to get eviction notice which was to be actioned end January however the tenant went into breathing space which has given her another 2 months in house have now applied eviction notice again and has until end April now
Council advise tenant must stay put or be intentionally making herself homeless council absolute shambles no communication with me just there advice is to save them time as no houses
Currently £4000 down would never rent my house again getting close to point where I am going to stop paying mortgage and let back repossess house as not worth stress
Cider Drinker
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Sign Up8:57 AM, 30th March 2024, About 8 months ago
Reply to the comment left by Stuart Graham at 29/03/2024 - 12:40This nonsense could lead to some tenants being evicted illegally, with a threat of violence. Not all landlords have the patience of Saints nor the financial reseerves to do it legally.
Shelly Feay
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Sign Up9:38 AM, 30th March 2024, About 8 months ago
Reply to the comment left by roger radford at 28/03/2024 - 11:25
The council does not tell tenants to stop paying their rent. Yes they tell tenants not to leave until landlord takes it to court to evict them, but as one of the questions on their forms is.. do you owe rent arrears. They advice not to stop paying it. Council can say a tenant as made themselves intentionally homeless if they don't pay the rent. They've either misheard what the employee as said or the employee as given them the wrong information. I've rented 2 properties that I've had to leave, because landlords were selling up. And both times I've been lucky to find somewhere else almost the day of the deadline. If I hadn't though, because of the councils policy of 'we will find you making yourself intentionally homeless, if you leave before being evicted by the court'. I'd have had no choice but to make my landlords (who needed money themselves, hence selling) take me to court. It's ridiculous.
dolly day dream
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Sign Up9:52 AM, 30th March 2024, About 8 months ago
Selective licensing. Do the LA have to pay £900 a year to themselves for their council houses.
Can anyone answer this please?
Keith Wellburn
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Sign Up10:08 AM, 30th March 2024, About 8 months ago
Reply to the comment left by dolly day dream at 30/03/2024 - 09:52
Generally a completely separate rule book to the PRS. Different EPC and EICR rules if I remember correctly.
Stella
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Sign Up10:39 AM, 30th March 2024, About 8 months ago
Reply to the comment left by dolly day dream at 30/03/2024 - 09:52
I would be astonished if they had to pay £900 /yr to themselves.
"Do as I say not as I do" is their motto
They also do not pay tax on their income which gives them big advantage over the rest of us.
Michael Johnson - Amzac Estates
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Sign Up11:52 AM, 30th March 2024, About 8 months ago
Reply to the comment left by dolly day dream at 30/03/2024 - 09:52
Under Welsh legislation only PRS landlords must be registered and have to pass the exams to hold the RSW licence- housing associations and local authorities have much easier standards applied to them.
Fairness is not a factor in the demonisation of the private landlord, we are 10 years into a long term plan to ensure that the private sector is slowly reduced only to be replaced by much larger corporate ownership which I think is the government’s long term aim. In 1988 it was never envisioned that over 20% of the population would be living within the private sector in 2024. Structurally it’s a problem as landlords get older they will jettison their property and the tenants will have nowhere to go so the government ( either colour) are hastening the demise and hoping that BTR will close the gap. I would guess that mass immigration was never factored in though so they can’t get away from the long term plan and we will watch people suffer the consequences ( which conveniently will be blamed on us)
Mick Roberts
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Sign Up15:28 PM, 30th March 2024, About 8 months ago
Reply to the comment left by dolly day dream at 30/03/2024 - 09:52
Nope,
Nor inspect theirselves.
I've just sent this to the Council this morning:
Dear Bulwell Riverside,
XXX
XXX, Leasehold Manager,
Relevant Council Parties
Can you please pass this onto whoever needs it.
Apparently, your tenant in XXX Top Valley has made threats to kill several of the surrounding flats tenants. They have reported this to you & Police.
Can you please record this email from me on your records along with the other tenants complaints & take the appropriate action with whatever powers you have just like you force Landlords to take action with ASB tenants.
As everyone wants to leave there & that is not good for the community.
I’m still waiting for a reply for the below sent approx 6 days ago. I had a phone call off someone called XXX & still waiting.
Selective Licensing Conditions are that we have to get a tenant a lost key within an hour or something like that. I actually get my tenants replacement lost keys within 10 minutes & that’s when I’m abroad. Council have took 6 days on this so far.
XXX Bulwell H – block code 290064870H
Excuse me writing to whoever as I don’t know who to write to now & the Council change the process every few years. And u XXX will somehow solve it ha ha.
Can I have two key fobs for XXX please.
I gather the Council has no automatic process to notify all key fob holders including Landlords that the Council has changed the codes.
I’ll repeat what I’ve sent before, as this has happened several times over the years:
I paid £15 each for several fobs few years ago.
When the tenants fob is not working.
I’ve took my spare to test & then give her. Mine is not working either.
Can u somehow get a fob to me & tenant when they haven’t got one. I don't live at XXX, but I do need a fob for emergencies please. U can drop mine off to me please.
Please contact me before just turning up. As many Council staff never get this message to ring before u come please.
I don’t mind paying for spares, but I hope that u know the ones we have paid for are not working, if u can please tell whoever to avoid confusion later.
XXX, why is this what is most definitely an emergency losing keys, why is this process horrendous? This is urgent.
Why can’t we get these instantly?
We need more like u XXX who can solve things quick.
Log below to show delays so far which are none of your fault.
I have been on phone 45 mins queuing changing swapping options ring back different department. whilst driving from Hucknall to Top Valley to Bulwell to Kimberley back to Bulwell to eventually get brilliant XXX who is emailng the Housing Patch manager to ring me. I’ve asked for phone call before 3pm as I’m at funeral thereafter.
The process used to be this:
XXX Key Fobs Door entry
Thurs 12 Jan 17, Leaseholders tell me to ring Bulwell Riverside.
They say the process is they programme ‘em there, they are £15, the system can take 36 hours to set it.
I need to come down to Riverside, prove my ID, confirming I am the owner.
In riverside main reception desk, see a housing office about getting a fob programmed for XXX.
Any queries, please ring me.
Yours sincerely,
Mick Roberts
Cider Drinker
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Sign Up9:32 AM, 31st March 2024, About 8 months ago
“ The council does not tell tenants to stop paying their rent.”
“…or the employee has given them the wrong information.”
The employee works for the Council. If the employee gives the wrong information, that is the Council telling the tenant to stop paying their rent.
There are many Lefties working at the the Council.
Mick Roberts
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Sign Up12:45 PM, 3rd April 2024, About 8 months ago
Reply to the comment left by Cider Drinker at 30/03/2024 - 08:57
Wow & this is why Landlords don't give people a chance next time.
I've started to send this to tenants now who pay super cheap rent & still ask for stuff to be done.
Feel free if anyone else wishes to use it.
If anyone slates me down for try to get tenants do their own stuff, yes does sound awful, but cheap rent don't pay for 2024 outgoings.
Ooh u getting the long text.
Ring me after you've read this.
Text below I'd had to prepare as many tenants don't understand you can't have cheap rent & your repairs done at same time. It's either correct rent & Landlord does your repairs, or cheap rent & u do the repairs yourself.
Every tenant gets a rent increase every year like all other Landlords, houses, tenants have to have, with inflation, cost of living, prices increasing.
Would u like the choice of not having a rent increase every year & you do your own repairs, maintenance? Which is a lot cheaper than the rent increase would be. Or paying the market rent & Landlord does your repairs?
Cause if I keep your rent at a 2019 level trying me best to look after u with the cheapest rent ever, I can't do that if got to pay for your repairs as well.
Cause that builder don't come along and say Ooh they've lived there 15 years and Mick is way undercharging these by £3000 per year, I'm gonna undercharge him too.
No, he charges me the going rate which has almost doubled along with most people's rents the last 5 years. Except I've got morals and a conscience trying to not increase your rent for loyalty. I can't do both.
If I was paying the rent you're paying, I wun't ask me Landlord for anything, I'd keep off the radar.
I'll still do your gas, but work this out:
Some people say Oh I can't afford that £200 repair Mick. I say surely u paying that repair is much better than u paying an extra £250pm?
Your rent should be £975. You saving £250pm £3000 per year. Last thing you want is your rent being bought up to normal levels. So can u see u much better off paying that repair than paying normal level rents every month.
I can't look after u with cheap rent AND do your 2024 repairs-Your 2019 rent doesn't pay for them. You can't have both.
I shun't even be asking & giving u the choice, but I am, I should just be giving u rent increase every 1 April. I am losing £3000 per year on u every year trying to look after u. Other Landlords just give u rent increase & that's that.
I'm also finding, I'm undercharging £3000 per year, tenant is not maintaining house with the saving from the rent they getting, they then giving me a crap house back 20 years later, I've not had the money in to fix it, & I've now got a £30,000 refurbishment bill. Whereas if charged the correct rent along the way, we'd have the money in to do it.
U will say horrible bastard but it's like going in a shop Morrisons where milk has gone up, yet u want to walk out shop paying the old price.
I feel for u if the Govt aren't paying enough towards your rent, but that is nothing to do with me & still doesn't get the builder paid. I can't give you £3000 per year AND pay for your repairs.
When I do finally put your rent up when the Govt increase the rate you are allowed, I'm still undercharging u, but I pull a bit back for one year, where you have made for 3 years before that & 3 years after that.